Urn

[flood1976]

How many hero were trap in the Urn??? and how was the Fighting Yank able to trap them all???? Another thing I found strange is why did the Fighting Yank not trap some super villain's in the Urn too?????

[MadMikeyD]

We have no knowledge of how many heroes were trapped. We were given "the List" of characters that we believed were the basis of this universe, but with the Prelude issue we see this involves more characters than were on the list - President West/Power Nelson and the Ghost being heroes not on the list. West wasn't trapped in the urn but the Ghost was. I wonder if Ross and Krueger have a definite list of classic characters they are going to use, or if they just plan to throw them in as they find uses for them. The Urn being the equivant of being a mutant in the Marvel Universe - the explaination needing no explaination.

As for the Super Villain question - if he was being manipulated for evil purposes, as it seems he was, he would not have been directed to do so. He was "following orders" like a good Soldier. He just should have questioned where those orders were coming from.

[flood1976]

I hope that the Urn will not always be used as the source for all the golden age heroes return.So far the only ones not affected are the Green Lama and Fighting Yank.

[Captain Canuck]

As for the Super Villain question - if he was being manipulated for evil purposes, as it seems he was, he would not have been directed to do so. He was "following orders" like a good Soldier. He just should have questioned where those orders were coming from.

I'd have to go have another look, but didn't the heroes represent hope? If so, trapping villains would have no purpose anyway. In other words, I think you're right, but I also think that's why Spirit didn't question it.

As far as how many there were, I agree that there might be a master list, but I doubt we'll ever see it in case the writers wanted to update it. Revealing it would just cause the writers to limit themselves.

[Glens46golden]

Even if they reveal who is on the list, they can make changes in the future. After all, the list would not be in stone. I sure hope Iron Jaw is in the Urn. I'm also hoping Fox's Wonderman is there also!

[Captain Canuck]

Even if they reveal who is on the list, they can make changes in the future. After all, the list would not be in stone. I sure hope Iron Jaw is in the Urn. I'm also hoping Fox's Wonderman is there also!

Depends. If they reveal it as part of the story, they're kind of commited to it.

Say Spirit writes down everyone so that the current group goes to find them all and make sure they're okay. Then, the writers want to throw Iron Jaw into the story, but he wasn't on Spirit's original list. How do you get around that? That Spirit forgot about him? "Oh yeah...That guy!"

If it's just a list on the website then sure, you can do whatever you want with it. But I think it's better kept as a mystery so that when characters appear, it's a surprise.

[Glens46golden]

There is always an easy was around something like the list. For example, if Iron Jaw wasn't on the list, and later it was decided to use Iron Jaw, the write would state the list only had good guys and Iron Jaw isn't a good guy. Something like this is easy to fix..I mean it is only a comic book!

[Captain Canuck]

There is always an easy was around something like the list. For example, if Iron Jaw wasn't on the list, and later it was decided to use Iron Jaw, the write would state the list only had good guys and Iron Jaw isn't a good guy. Something like this is easy to fit..I mean it is only a comic book!

If you're talking about the real world then yes, they can do whatever they want if they have a master list, I totally agree. They don't even have to explain it.

[flood1976]

Who said that Fighting Yank was the only person to use the Urn.Who knows how many used it in the past. :confused:

[Captain Canuck]

Who said that Fighting Yank was the only person to use the Urn.Who knows how many used it in the past. :confused:

When Yank is given his orders, he's told that Hitler acquired the urn during WW1.

Of course, they could be wrong. Or lying. But Yank did find it where they said it would be.

[Glens46golden]

Let say that they wanted to use Supersnipe in a Dynamite comic and he wasn't on the list of heroes put in the Urn. All they would have to say is that he was in a dark corner of the Urn and they didn"t know he was there. It is no big deal, let Ross print a list of which heroes are in the damn Urn!

[Captain Canuck]

Let say that they wanted to use Supersnipe in a Dynamite comic and he wasn't on the list of heroes put in the Urn. All they would have to say is that he was in a dark corner of the Urn and they didn"t know he was there. It is no big deal, let Ross print a list of which heroes are in the damn Urn!

I'm not arguing with you, Glen, but I'm still unclear as to whether you mean in the comic book itself or in the real world.

Yes, if Ross wants to give Newsarama a list of the heroes he intends to use, that's fine. If one day they come across a character that they want to add to it, no big deal.

But if it's actually done as part of the story, it wouldn't make sense for them to do it. Do you own issue #0? Yank physically went to each hero and had him (or her) sucked into the urn. If Yank ever gives a full list of who he put in there, it makes no sense that he would forget someone.

The best explanation around it might be to say that Yank deliberately omitted Supersnipe for some personal reason, but even if that works, why paint yourself in that corner? Especially since you would be pinning that behaviour on a character who is trying to right past wrongs.

So what I'm basically saying is if Ross wants to issue a list, go right ahead (the character sketches in the backs of the books are pretty much that very thing anyway), but I doubt he'll do it as part of continuity.

I guess the reason we don't fully see eye to eye is that I don't buy into the "it's just comics" mentality. Even if it's just comics, I still want the story to make sense within the rules they've set. To just shrug it off as Supersnipe being in a dark corner would be pretty weak story-telling. Who put him there? Why? When? How did he or she get access to the urn?

These (and probably more) are all questions that they would have to do deal that they could easily avoid by never making the list part of continuity. So while I am personally interested in seeing it, I can understand why we never saw it in the comic book itself.

Edit: Name correction. I kept referring to the Fighting Yank as "Spirit".

[Glens46golden]

Okay, we won't argue anymore. I guess I'm upset becasue I'd really like to see a list printed. As for good story telling, I think the Urn was a very good story telling idea. The way Ross has done this, all these guys were put in the Urn in their early or mid-twenties. They shouldn't age for years. I guess I'm exciting about Dynamite becasue they are using the best characters from many companies and have the potential of being one of the Big 3. This hasn't happened since Tower Comics came out with the Thunder Agents.

[MadMikeyD]

I'm of two minds on this subject.

1) I'd really like to see a definitive list so I can research all of these characters before hand.

2) I do not want to see a definitive list so that I can be surprised by the appearance of new characters.

I can't decide which I really want. If there was a list, I would probably limit my GA research and reading to only those characters. Without one, I'm discovering even more characters during my research than I otherwise would, which is also a lot of fun.

[Captain Canuck]

Yeah, don't get me wrong, I'm pretty curious too, especially when I saw the character designs at the end of each issue. Taht became one of the things I looked forward to most!

I think I would like to see the list too because even if I know a character I like is expected to be used, I won't necessarily know when he'll pop up so it'll still be a surprise (like the one Yank got when he took three arrows in the chest. Great surprise!).

I'm not AGAINST seeing it in the story, but I think I understand why they'd be relunctant to put it there. That's all I'm saying.

[Captain Canuck]

Here's a little more food for thought for you; I wonder if Yanks' mission involved going to other countries?

Those of view with sharp detective skills probably peiced together that I'm Canadian. ;) I know of a couple of WW2-time heroes in Canadian comics at the time. Did Europe have them as well?

It stands to reason that if Yank was sent to recover the heroes because they represented hope, he might have had to do so in other parts of the world as well.

What I don't know is how the "public domain" laws work. I came across a picture of a football game here in the 20's. It was said to be public domain, but does that mean that literally everyone can use it, or can it just be used in the country in which the work was done? I assume it's everyone.

If so, if they were so inclined, the writers might be able to include a group of international heroes as well. I'd be all over that.

[MadMikeyD]

Interesting. Copyright laws pertaining to Public Domain do differ from country to country. I think the US laws are currently the most adverse to things falling into Public Domain, though. The US has too many large corporations who need to keep control of their characters (Mickey Mouse, Superman, etc.). An example of the differing copyright laws actually just came up as Popeye is now Public Domain in Europe (http://www.comicbookresources.com/?page=article&id=19343), but still very much under copyright in the US. Another example would be Peter Pan. The book and character are Public Domain in the US, but are still copyright protected in the UK. The UK keeps renewing the copyright since it is owned by a children's hospital there and generates a steady income for them.

[Captain Canuck]

Many of you are probably aware of it, but here's a good resource for foreign superhero (mostly) characters.

http://www.internationalhero.co.uk/nonus.htm

Man, Spain has got some sharp looking ones...

[Black Terror]

I just assumed that every PD hero was in the Urn. In the sketch book they had the Shield and he is NOT a PD hero.

[comixfan1980]

Okay, we won't argue anymore. I guess I'm upset becasue I'd really like to see a list printed. As for good story telling, I think the Urn was a very good story telling idea. The way Ross has done this, all these guys were put in the Urn in their early or mid-twenties. They shouldn't age for years. I guess I'm exciting about Dynamite becasue they are using the best characters from many companies and have the potential of being one of the Big 3. This hasn't happened since Tower Comics came out with the Thunder Agents.

I agree about the Urn, it was a great way to bring the characters back and to explain a lot of things that may have "WTF" type questions to them.

About the "list" of characters debate, I'm kinda with Mikey on this one. I'd love to know who is on their way so I can check things out before hand, but I love being suprised and being like "Yes!!!!" when I see an old favorite or a character I always wanted to read about.

[flood1976]

I just assumed that every PD hero was in the Urn. In the sketch book they had the Shield and he is NOT a PD hero.


Sorry Black Terror which sketch book did you see the Shield in????

[MadMikeyD]

I think he's referring to that first image of the American Spirit which was in the original Preview book (and later in Fighting Yank's War Journal). Below/inside the Spirit it shows various patriotic heroes including The Shield, Captain America, Uncle Sam, Captain Courageaous, Captain Battle, and several others. It was not intended to show characters appearing in Superpowers - Captain America is also very much copyrighted - only to show the inspiration for the Spirit.

On a side note - I'd rather see the Archie heroes in Superpowers than the main DCU...

[flood1976]

I think he's referring to that first image of the American Spirit which was in the original Preview book (and later in Fighting Yank's War Journal). Below/inside the Spirit it shows various patriotic heroes including The Shield, Captain America, Uncle Sam, Captain Courageaous, Captain Battle, and several others. It was not intended to show characters appearing in Superpowers - Captain America is also very much copyrighted - only to show the inspiration for the Spirit.

On a side note - I'd rather see the Archie heroes in Superpowers than the main DCU...


Thanks for the update Mad Mikey and I agree with you 100% I would love to see Archies heroes as a part of the PSP universe.

[flood1976]

I was wondering why where the superheroes sidekicks not affected by there stay in the Urn?

[MadMikeyD]

How do we know they were not affected? We have only seen the one picture of them (Prelude) that I'm aware of.

[MadMikeyD]

I just assumed that every PD hero was in the Urn.

Well, not everyone was actually in the Urn. Here are the heroes we know for sure were not:

Green Lama (hidden in Tibet)
Samson (wandering the globe unknown to everyone)
Dynamic Man & Dynamic Boy (forming Dynamic Forces)
American Crusader (whereabouts unknown)