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Homelander/Black Noir connection

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  • Homelander/Black Noir connection

    There is a theory that the two are clones; it seemed to catch ground when it was revealed the Homelander tricked Maeve into sleeping with Black Noir, partially because of the "we're the same size" line. That, and a strong desire to have Butcher's backstory to have more to it for some reason. But they still had to blindfold Maeve to pull it off and BN kept his mask on- now, maybe the expression on his face alone would have told her something was up if he's Homie's twin, but I'm not too sure. There's also the fact that Homelander said that he doesn't remember doing the things he saw in the pictures Butcher sent to him or what happened to Butcher's wife. That's a point in favor of that theory- but we found this out when the Homelander was have an extended conversation with his reflection. Dude's crazy, so having blackouts isn't that much of a stretch. The part about them going way back implies that he would know that BN looks like him, so he would probably assume that BN was the one in pics before assuming it was something he didn't remember.

    There's also the fact that Vought Guy, of all people, would know that Black Noir and Homie are identical, but he talks like he believes it was the Homelander who was in the photos. A point in favor for this theory is the fact that whoever raped Becky, Homie or not, never said a word and had the same sort of creepy smile that one could imagine BN having. Its still possible, but I think if you're invested in this theory without any more info than we currently have, you're setting yourself up for disappointment with the reveal that it was Homie like they said all along. They will have to pile on a mountain of info to sell this. I'm open to it, myself.

    If the Air Force comes in with those adapted missiles we were promised issues ago and takes out supes en masse, I love the idea of the series going on for several issues in a post-Supe world*- in a series like this you always knew it was building up to a drastic change of the status quo towards the end- an example of them NOT doing it would be Vought's stock taking a nose dive and them quietly going away, supes being phased out(I know there are problems with that idea, of course), etc. It would fit with the idea that vought American is the true big bad and the supes are, in the end, what they always were said to be- Vought products. I always figured we were leaning to an ending that simply put, left the world having very different feelings about supes at the end than they had in the beginning and I like the idea of living for 6-7 issues in that world instead of the final issue. If Homie dies in the next issue or three and BN's backstory isn't fully revealed by then, then I think there's a chance of BN being the rapist all along being canon.

    And maybe Butcher will finally think he's avenged Becky before realizing there's one last thing he has to do. That's another thing I would like to see- what would Butcher really be without his mission? Of course, there's the secondary mission of stomping any cunt with a cape, so I bet there would only be the briefest period of self-reflection before he moved on. All the same it would be interesting to see.

    Would you believe I had typed this on a text file and saved it for when my account was finally approved? More to come on other subjects, but this one was the bulk of what I wrote.

    *- and I want to add that by "post-supe world" I obviously don't think every single supe will be taken out in 65 or thereabouts, but that this would be a world where the idea of supes will be discredited and the world will know what they truly are.
    Last edited by Dustin; 01-31-2012, 06:26 PM.

  • #2
    I have no idea . . . I have to start reading the boys if it can provoke this much thought . . . it has to be awesome there is no possibility that something that can provoke this much thought is not awesome

    I am goign to pick up whatever of "the boys" I can find at the comic book store tomarrow when I go pick up warriors of mars!

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    • #3
      Interesting theory...

      That would be an interesting explanation for why BN survived falling out of the plane on 9/11.

      *Spoiler for unrelated movie*
      .
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      .
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      .
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      Like in "The Prestige", where two identical twin brothers decide to live one life.

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      • #4
        I actually think it's more likely now that Homie is the rapist/baby eater- the crazed expression on his face after he knocked Maeve's block off made him more credible as the perpetrator of such acts.

        And I always leaned toward Homie being that guy anyway- I detailed above what info they would have to give us to not make "Black Noir raped Becky and killed those people in the photographs," but they're getting down to the wire to not make it seem like an ass-pull. Having just re-read the entire series, though, its obvious Ennis does plan things out way in advance- its simply a matter of withholding information too long so most of the audience doesn't see the twist coming and having the reveal come off as an ass-pull.

        I just can't see Homelander never having seen Black Noir's face, which is what is required for this theory to work. It does make sense that the two are more closely connected than the rest of the Seven; BN was the second to come along and maybe Vought tried the same recipe that worked so well before but got less impressive results this time.

        It's Stilwell believing that Homelander is the man in those photos that is almost enough to stick a fork in that theory for me. BN is going to be important in the next two issues, given some cryptic lines in the solicitations, so we'll know soon enough.

        In the end, if BN is a Homie twin and he raped Becky and he tore up those people, it won't matter for Butcher's character. He would pause, only for a moment, at the realization that he has been hating the wrong man because in his mind, there really isn't a "wrong" supe to hate. If BN is HL's clone, it will play off in the story, not the characters' arcs.

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        • #5
          Originally posted by Dustin View Post
          I actually think it's more likely now that Homie is the rapist/baby eater- the crazed expression on his face after he knocked Maeve's block off made him more credible as the perpetrator of such acts.
          Most likely, after seeing the photos, he was probably thinking, so I killed all these people, what's a few more?

          It seems that someone (BN, VG or an unknown party) is trying to deliberately make Homie crazy. If so, Who and how do they profit?

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          • #6
            Originally posted by MisterS View Post
            Most likely, after seeing the photos, he was probably thinking, so I killed all these people, what's a few more?

            It seems that someone (BN, VG or an unknown party) is trying to deliberately make Homie crazy. If so, Who and how do they profit?
            What do you base this theory on? The fact that we don't know who sent the pics to Mallory and Butcher?

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            • #7
              Originally posted by Dustin View Post
              What do you base this theory on? The fact that we don't know who sent the pics to Mallory and Butcher?
              That and in VG's own words in issue 40, 'were it not for the evidence in the photos, he might not have any psychotic tendencies at all.'

              Mind, it's just a thought...

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              • #8
                Actually, I think it was "were it not for the photos, I would not believe him to have any psychotic tendencies at all." Or some variation thereof.

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                • #9
                  Just how many examples are there in the series of some unidentified, clued-in person stirring *hit up?

                  The pictures of HL killing the family

                  The loose ends from the "Jack From Jupiter" cluster (can't remember- Vought Girl released the photos to escalate the confrontation, but she didn't order the original murder, did she?), like who exactly killed Terror? Was it really Jack?

                  Somebody is very clued in, and the same person is trying like hell to start a fight. Rayner? Mallory? The Legend?

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                  • #10
                    Originally posted by statsman View Post
                    Just how many examples are there in the series of some unidentified, clued-in person stirring *hit up?

                    The pictures of HL killing the family

                    The loose ends from the "Jack From Jupiter" cluster (can't remember- Vought Girl released the photos to escalate the confrontation, but she didn't order the original murder, did she?), like who exactly killed Terror? Was it really Jack?

                    Somebody is very clued in, and the same person is trying like hell to start a fight. Rayner? Mallory? The Legend?
                    Oh, I absolutely agree on that. I was just saying that it wasn't outside influences that made the Homelander cuckoo.

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                    • #11
                      OK, I've got it. Black Noir is not some kind of zombie. He is the only supe capable of critical reasoning. He is pretending to be a moron, and he probably is a bad guy, but he actually is working a plan. For those who argue that any display of competence goes against the "rules" established by Ennis, I would respond by noting BN is the exception that proves the rule.

                      What do we know about him?

                      We never see his face.
                      He is very powerful.
                      He snuck up on Hughie during Herogasm, goosed him, and then left Hughie to go on his way.
                      Everybody thinks he's an idiot.
                      He has public displays of incompetence (crashing the Harrier).

                      He is the one that sent the pics of HL to the Boys. He is the one that killed Terror. He is sick of this costume game, and wants to end it. (Could he be a deep cover mole?)

                      What do you think?

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                      • #12
                        Homelander was number 1. Black Noir was the second of the Seven created. Maeve was the third. Suspiciously, Black Noir is the only one of the big three who can't fly. BN would need to be able to fly to at least sneak back to the Flatiron to kill Terror, so pretending to have to rely on the others to get around is a pretty ingenious gambit. And I have been wracking my brain trying to guess what is so important about BN that it will play into 64-65. And that's as good a guess as any.
                        Last edited by Dustin; 02-21-2012, 11:19 AM.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Originally posted by statsman View Post
                          OK, I've got it. Black Noir is not some kind of zombie. He is the only supe capable of critical reasoning. He is pretending to be a moron, and he probably is a bad guy, but he actually is working a plan. For those who argue that any display of competence goes against the "rules" established by Ennis, I would respond by noting BN is the exception that proves the rule.

                          What do we know about him?

                          We never see his face.
                          He is very powerful.
                          He snuck up on Hughie during Herogasm, goosed him, and then left Hughie to go on his way.
                          Everybody thinks he's an idiot.
                          He has public displays of incompetence (crashing the Harrier).

                          He is the one that sent the pics of HL to the Boys. He is the one that killed Terror. He is sick of this costume game, and wants to end it. (Could he be a deep cover mole?)

                          What do you think?

                          You're attributing levels of subtlety to Ennis that he has never before displayed.

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Originally posted by Kamakazi View Post
                            You're attributing levels of subtlety to Ennis that he has never before displayed.
                            You're right. How about this? All of the above about BN, plus he's a gay psychopath! Now he's an Ennis villain!

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                            • #15
                              I also want to add- the revelation of Black Noir being Homie's twin might have less of an impact with Braun's art, even though I think he's a fantastic artist. One panel from Hl's mirror convo with himself could have been identical to one with Butcher making the same face to Mallory save for hair and eye color.

                              It would be like the revelation of Mallory being the English gentleman- Ennis always assume, I'm sure, that Robertson would draw Mallory for that and the first time he appeared in the main series. But with Mallory's first appearance in the Boys being drawn by Braun and his appearance in Higland Laddie being drawn by McCrea, I'm sure a lot of people were left wondering what the point was in withholding his face for so long.

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