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  • #16
    Originally posted by ChastMastr View Post
    I don't think they're "emo" in that sense (I haven't seen them mope and cry... well... at all, really...) -- over at DC, and I've posted on various threads a LOT about this over on CBR and the like, I think DC's post-Flashpoint universe has made a lot of them kind of jerky and definitely less heroic. Over at Marvel I think things are much better than a few years ago as far as heroism is concerned. And, oh, I was so looking forward to the new Supreme series...

    (Since most threads here are Dynamite-specific, I haven't mentioned my feelings about other comics here much.)

    Part of the issue of classic-style heroes is that many of us want, not "classic-style heroes" full stop, but "classic-style" Superman, Green Lantern, Wonder Woman, etc. specifically.
    strange thing, Marvel Heroes, and DC superheroes . . . the reputation of the two seems to be swapping

    it seems crazy that we live in a world where the avengers got a hit movie before the justice league


    craaaaaazy days . . . maybe dynamite should make some heroes . . .

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    • #17
      Originally posted by Ralok View Post
      strange thing, Marvel Heroes, and DC superheroes . . . the reputation of the two seems to be swapping
      Not too strange, I think. Some of the key creators and even editors have jumped ship, as it were, so a few years ago we saw Waid, Rucka, Wacker over at DC, and now all three are at Marvel. (Busiek is not at Marvel but he's also missing from DC.) The people who were doing the excellent 52 series--well, only Morrison is left, I think, and he's doing Action (set in the past), Batman Inc. (mostly spinning out of the pre-Flashpoint stuff and even written in such a way that--according to an interview with the artist--you can ignore Flashpoint and it will basically read the same with the rest of the Morrison Batman stuff), and other than Multiversity, that's it. James Robinson is doing the Earth-Two book (another universe), the Shade series (more or less the same situation as Batman Inc.), and again that's it. Paul Levitz is doing Worlds' Finest (alt-universe characters), Legion (set in future), and that's it. Perhaps it's just me but most of the stuff I'm liking from DC isn't set in the present-day heavily-rebooted mainstream DCU...

      I also think that there is a correlation between Marvel's going downhill and Dan Buckley coming on board (2004)--and, while Buckley is still there, I think Axel Alonso (last year or so) has improved things a lot. Meanwhile, over at DC, I certainly think that the whole Johns/Lee/Flashpoint situation is part of why things are becoming less good--though I liked a lot of Johns' stuff in the past, I think the reboot has been disastrous overall. (And I'm hearing bits and bobs online that suggest that some of the darker, grimmer pre-Flashpoint stuff was more editorially mandated than anything else--the War with New Krypton, Amazons Attack, etc. It seems to me that the anomalous DC storylines I disliked the most before have now become the official "house style" for the DCU, which saddens me.)

      Additionally, the more that disgruntled creators are taken off of, or simply flee books at DC, a troubling pattern has been emerging of being dicked around by editorial and made to change things at their whim (literally going back and forth about plot points while the writers try to keep up with the retcons du jour), and a sense that the current approach owes more to trying to make the new DCU into a sort of mindless "action movie" style rather than tell good stories.

      Examples:

      George Perez (very detailed)
      John Rozum (very detailed)
      Amy Reeder (not too much info but it still sounds sad and of one piece with the others)

      Plus of course things like Before Watchmen (ouch) and the like. There's been a definite shift in the way DC does things in the last couple of years.

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      • #18
        Originally posted by Ralok View Post
        it means tehy spend more time whining about their problems, then trying to be super heroes, or even trying to solve these problems. It means they mope, cry, and fight with their friends, and we are supposed to feel bad for them every time their hamster dies

        "oh boo hoo, my superpowers allow me to fly I am so tormented"
        So... pretty much every super hero created since Stan Lee first wrote Spider-Man? That was the thing that put "The Marvel Age of Comics" on the map, so to speak, since DC at the time was nearly 100% plot-driven with just about zero characterization -- though you can still find early Silver Age Superman and Batman "emo" stories, since emotional weaknesses were exploited as a plot device with the same regularity as kryptonite.

        But yeah, the 1960s tag line for Marvel was (as found on an early mass-market FF paperback reprint) "Super heroes with super problems"
        Last edited by positronic; 07-26-2012, 02:17 AM.
        DE pull list: Will Eisner's The Spirit: The Corpse Makers, ERB's The Greatest Adventure, Green Hornet '66 Meets The Spirit, PSP: Herokillers, KISS/Vampirella, Mighty Mouse

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        • #19
          Originally posted by ChastMastr View Post
          Perhaps it's just me but most of the stuff I'm liking from DC isn't set in the present-day heavily-rebooted mainstream DCU...
          Plus of course things like Before Watchmen (ouch) and the like. There's been a definite shift in the way DC does things in the last couple of years.
          So much to comment on here but I'll keep this short 'cause it's off-topic...
          Mostly agree re: your comments on DC, although I'll draw the line at Morrison's Action Comics. All Star Superman was brilliant, this is utter shite.
          Yes DC is inclined to shift with the breeze and pull the rug out unexpectedly whenever they have a mind to. Losing Paul Levitz (as the helmsman) has not been good for the company. I have little respect for DiDio. On the other hand, I must say that so far, Before Watchmen has been better than 80% of the other books they publish (I was unexpectedly stunned by Joe Kubert's inking on Nite Owl). On the New 52 front, I am down to the 3 GL books, Aquaman, All Star Western, LSH. The GL books are in outer space, Legion in the future (with Levitz as the saving grace), Jonah Hex in the past (even though there's been an attempt to bolster sales with an oblique Batman tie-in, they haven't eradicated anything from Hex's previous history; again, continuity of writers from pre-52). If/when Aquaman starts to tie in more closely to Justice League and the other rebooted DC franchises, I'll probably drop it.

          Sorry to say I don't share your optimism about Marvel -- I am dreading "Marvel NOW" and all of their slavish supplication to their movie franchises (Marcus Johnson/Samuel Jackson/Nick Fury Jr. -- bah!). Waid's Daredevil is a bright spot, and I will probably continue reading Winter Soldier. Very, very shaky on the rest of their line of comics.
          Last edited by positronic; 07-26-2012, 02:52 AM.
          DE pull list: Will Eisner's The Spirit: The Corpse Makers, ERB's The Greatest Adventure, Green Hornet '66 Meets The Spirit, PSP: Herokillers, KISS/Vampirella, Mighty Mouse

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          • #20
            I know more about comics than I ever wanted to know thanks to this thread :I

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            • #21
              Originally posted by Ralok View Post
              I know more about comics than I ever wanted to know thanks to this thread :I
              I live to serve.

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              • #22
                Will Wizard or Hero comic magazines ever rise up again or are these types of magazines dead replaced by internet sites?
                Last edited by helwen; 08-22-2012, 01:06 PM.

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