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  • Seriously Dynamite....

    First it was Black Terror.....

    Then it was The Last Phantom......

    Then a 3 year absence of Project Superpowers.....

    Then Kato went bye-bye.........

    Then they cancelled the entire Kirby line......

    Then came Flash Gordon......

    And now it's Peter Cannon.....

    *Sigh*. Cue the long and annoying "this is a business" speech now and tell us that there is a huge announcement coming up to simmer us a down a bit. Seriously, I'm getting annoyed by this and I don't care what the excuses are, I'm a loyal reader and as soon as I attach myself onto one of these books Dynamite cancels it and I'm getting sick of it. It's NOT my responsibility to promote Dynamite's books, it's theirs, and I'm getting tired of enjoying certain titles just to see them die. At least Valiant isn't cancelling their books, maybe I'll just go see what's going on there and hope I like them because almost everything I've liked from DE has gotten the axe.

    Maybe it's time to say goodbye.

  • #2
    You could enjoy them as long as they continue to come out, like limited series. I'm pretty confident Dynamite doesn't want to cancel anything unless they have to either, and they wouldn't want to announce a series was ending until it really, definitely was.

    Comment


    • #3
      Originally posted by Chadster View Post
      At least Valiant isn't cancelling their books,
      Yeah, look at the years of publishing experience there. A whole 9 issues in a row! That's a fair comparison. But it's very generous of you to ignore the fact that Valiant's entire line was cancelled for over ten years.

      Maybe it's escaped your notice, but Marvel, DC, Dark Horse, and Image cancel books that aren't selling well enough, too. The fact that they have huge lines of titles, many of which have been going on for years, might tend to obscure that fact. If I were to compile a list of DC or Marvel titles (either one, not both combined) that I used to read and enjoy, before they were cancelled, from the same time frame as you're talking about, it would easily be two or three times as long as the list you've given above.

      Then there's the fact that when you have a core group of consistently good sellers, profits from those titles tend to subsidize the publishing of lesser-selling titles, giving them a chance to remain unprofitable for longer - until they finally find an audience, or are ultimately culled to make way for new titles. Dynamite doesn't have that luxury. So what you're asking for is tantamount to asking Dynamite to continue to publish titles that are losing money... resulting in them going out of business altogether. Maybe you'd prefer that, so that you can fondly remember Dynamite as a publisher whose titles you used to enjoy reading.

      Be thankful for the fact that Dynamite is attempting to publish the kind of titles that larger publishers generally ignore. If you want to lay blame for the fact that they're also being cancelled when they don't sell well, blame it on the lack of good taste of the general comic book buying public.

      You could always play it safe and check the list of Diamond Comics Distribution's top-selling titles, and just stick with best-selling titles that you're pretty sure won't ever be cancelled. But then again, look what happened with DC's New 52 and Marvel Now -- NO title is completely safe from cancellation. It may be replaced by another title that is "similar but not quite the same", but that might not make former fans of the earlier incarnation happy either.
      Last edited by positronic; 01-25-2013, 06:26 AM.
      DE pull list: Will Eisner's The Spirit: The Corpse Makers, ERB's The Greatest Adventure, Green Hornet '66 Meets The Spirit, PSP: Herokillers, KISS/Vampirella, Mighty Mouse

      Comment


      • #4
        Originally posted by ChastMastr View Post
        You could enjoy them as long as they continue to come out, like limited series. I'm pretty confident Dynamite doesn't want to cancel anything unless they have to either, and they wouldn't want to announce a series was ending until it really, definitely was.
        Maybe Dynamite should just start all their new titles out by announcing them as limited series. Then if sales warrant it towards the end of that announced run, they could always change their mind and announce "Due to popular demand, Title X has just been upgraded to a continuing series!". To what would undoubtedly be spontaneous outpourings of joy from the fans.
        DE pull list: Will Eisner's The Spirit: The Corpse Makers, ERB's The Greatest Adventure, Green Hornet '66 Meets The Spirit, PSP: Herokillers, KISS/Vampirella, Mighty Mouse

        Comment


        • #5
          Originally posted by Chadster View Post
          First it was Black Terror.....

          Then it was The Last Phantom......

          Then a 3 year absence of Project Superpowers.....

          Then Kato went bye-bye.........

          Then they cancelled the entire Kirby line......

          Then came Flash Gordon......

          And now it's Peter Cannon.....

          *Sigh*. Cue the long and annoying "this is a business" speech now and tell us that there is a huge announcement coming up to simmer us a down a bit. Seriously, I'm getting annoyed by this and I don't care what the excuses are, I'm a loyal reader and as soon as I attach myself onto one of these books Dynamite cancels it and I'm getting sick of it. It's NOT my responsibility to promote Dynamite's books, it's theirs, and I'm getting tired of enjoying certain titles just to see them die. At least Valiant isn't cancelling their books, maybe I'll just go see what's going on there and hope I like them because almost everything I've liked from DE has gotten the axe.

          Maybe it's time to say goodbye.
          I'm not so much upset about books being cancelled that I am that titles such as Project Superpowers laid dormant for almost 2 1/2 years before Dynamite spoke up about what's going on with it, and adding in a small comment like "just wait!" isn't enough to keep fans happy. I'm upset that Peter Cannon is ending, much in the same way I was upset that Flash Gordon was ending when I found out, and I agree that it is frustrating to finally find comics that you love just to have them disappear soon after you've fallen in love with them. The Kirby: Genesis line of books was the biggest knife in my heart along with Dynamite's treatment of the Project Superpowers line.

          Chadster is right in one regard. Reading the same ol' speech about how "Business is business" doesn't help to heal the wounds, and other members hoping on the forums drilling him about how it's the "same with the other companies" doesn't help either (even if that IS the answer). What helps is companies promoting their product and trying to sell more issues and NOT telling the fans it's up to them to support the books and to promote for them. We are NOT being paid to do so and we are NOT a publishers marketing department. Any other POV in this subject is null and void. The publishers tickle our palms with titles we enjoy and rip them away just as fast and it ISN'T fair, but what is even less fair is that certain titles lay dormant for years with no word from the publisher. But that's been said a million times both here and on CBR.

          Positronic......

          Just so you know, the Valiant Entertainment that owns these Valiant characters is NOT the same Valiant that owned them in the early 90's. That original Valiant was run by different people and was an entirely different company, this Valiant is a whole new company built from the ground up by people who know what they're doing. The books are all selling extremely well and their stories have been the absolute best stories I've read in comics since....well.....possibly ever, so don't blame the characters for a different companies decisions because Valiant was selling well back then and is selling well now, it's the former company that screwed it all up and when the books were cancelled for good that was Acclaim's decision: Not Valiant's.

          Comment


          • #6
            "Maybe it's time to say good-bye"

            This last comment by Chadster kind of sat with me for a little bit. I truly love Dynamite Entertainment, I love the pulp line of books, the classic characters, the Superpowers and Kirby books, and the ever growing lineup of fantasy based books they publish. But I too am growing tired of the under-promoting, the cancellations, the excuses, the silence, and other such practices and 2013 is going to be a huge year for Dynamite to step up and prove to me that they're not going to continue this trend. My Dynamite pull list went from being 16 books a month this time last year to being 8 books a month now (with 2 or 3 being added this year when they come), so it's basically been cut in half and I have no qualms with dropping more titles in the future (Vampi, Bionic Man, LORJ, the WOM stuff) if I feel Dynamite is treating it's readers unfairly.

            I will monitor the company in 2013 and if I feel the company isn't up to par with it's practices I'll drop everything that I feel I can live without, which is basically all but the Pulp stuff (Masks, Shadow, Spider, GH, et all). There, I said it.

            Comment


            • #7
              It can be a tough loss when your favorite comic book comes to an end or is cancelled by it's publisher, trust me I've been there, but it does happen at every publisher despite not wanting to hear that as your answer. Dynamite tries hard, and even I get mad at them when things "happen", but I would never walk away because of it because I love their output and it keeps me around.
              Dynamite Entertainment
              Forum Administrator


              Check out Dynamite on Twitter here!

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              • #8
                Originally posted by manga4life View Post
                Chadster is right in one regard. Reading the same ol' speech about how "Business is business" doesn't help to heal the wounds, and other members hoping on the forums drilling him about how it's the "same with the other companies" doesn't help either (even if that IS the answer). What helps is companies promoting their product and trying to sell more issues and NOT telling the fans it's up to them to support the books and to promote for them. We are NOT being paid to do so and we are NOT a publishers marketing department. Any other POV in this subject is null and void. The publishers tickle our palms with titles we enjoy and rip them away just as fast and it ISN'T fair, but what is even less fair is that certain titles lay dormant for years with no word from the publisher. But that's been said a million times both here and on CBR.
                Dynamite isn't the villain here. They WANT to publish titles that are successful and make money, AND they want to publish the kinds of books we like to read. The REAL villains here are your fellow comic book readers, the thousands of consumers that DON'T buy those Dynamite titles and thus enable Dynamite to continue publishing them. So direct your ire at THEM, not at Dynamite.

                Originally posted by manga4life View Post
                Just so you know, the Valiant Entertainment that owns these Valiant characters is NOT the same Valiant that owned them in the early 90's. That original Valiant was run by different people and was an entirely different company, this Valiant is a whole new company built from the ground up by people who know what they're doing. The books are all selling extremely well and their stories have been the absolute best stories I've read in comics since....well.....possibly ever, so don't blame the characters for a different companies decisions because Valiant was selling well back then and is selling well now, it's the former company that screwed it all up and when the books were cancelled for good that was Acclaim's decision: Not Valiant's.
                Blah, blah, blah... I know, I know... Who cares? The point here is that they haven't published a single title since they've taken over the characters that's racked up as many issues as the very titles Chadster cited as Dynamite having cancelled. So don't go telling me "they aren't cancelling their books" -- because they haven't been in business long enough to have cancelled anything. When they've been around for 7 or 8 years like Dynamite has, THEN you can tell me all about their wonderful history of not cancelling books and what publishing geniuses they are. Like I said, NOT a fair comparison.
                DE pull list: Will Eisner's The Spirit: The Corpse Makers, ERB's The Greatest Adventure, Green Hornet '66 Meets The Spirit, PSP: Herokillers, KISS/Vampirella, Mighty Mouse

                Comment


                • #9
                  Originally posted by manga4life View Post
                  "Maybe it's time to say good-bye"

                  This last comment by Chadster kind of sat with me for a little bit. I truly love Dynamite Entertainment, I love the pulp line of books, the classic characters, the Superpowers and Kirby books, and the ever growing lineup of fantasy based books they publish. But I too am growing tired of the under-promoting, the cancellations, the excuses, the silence, and other such practices and 2013 is going to be a huge year for Dynamite to step up and prove to me that they're not going to continue this trend. My Dynamite pull list went from being 16 books a month this time last year to being 8 books a month now (with 2 or 3 being added this year when they come), so it's basically been cut in half and I have no qualms with dropping more titles in the future (Vampi, Bionic Man, LORJ, the WOM stuff) if I feel Dynamite is treating it's readers unfairly.

                  I will monitor the company in 2013 and if I feel the company isn't up to par with it's practices I'll drop everything that I feel I can live without, which is basically all but the Pulp stuff (Masks, Shadow, Spider, GH, et all). There, I said it.
                  This is entertainment, it's not a religion. When Dynamite is no longer producing the kind of books that I enjoy reading, I'll stop buying Dynamite titles. Pretty simple equation. But I'm not going to close my mind to new titles that I might enjoy just because of other titles from the same publisher that were cancelled in the past. Well, you know, unless they did something drastic like cancelling their entire line of titles all at once and replacing them all with new ones. That might just piss me off past the point of forgiveness.
                  DE pull list: Will Eisner's The Spirit: The Corpse Makers, ERB's The Greatest Adventure, Green Hornet '66 Meets The Spirit, PSP: Herokillers, KISS/Vampirella, Mighty Mouse

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Originally posted by positronic View Post
                    Dynamite isn't the villain here. They WANT to publish titles that are successful and make money, AND they want to publish the kinds of books we like to read. The REAL villains here are your fellow comic book readers, the thousands of consumers that DON'T buy those Dynamite titles and thus enable Dynamite to continue publishing them. So direct your ire at THEM, not at Dynamite.



                    Blah, blah, blah... I know, I know... Who cares? The point here is that they haven't published a single title since they've taken over the characters that's racked up as many issues as the very titles Chadster cited as Dynamite having cancelled. So don't go telling me "they aren't cancelling their books" -- because they haven't been in business long enough to have cancelled anything. When they've been around for 7 or 8 years like Dynamite has, THEN you can tell me all about their wonderful history of not cancelling books and what publishing geniuses they are. Like I said, NOT a fair comparison.
                    Well, if Dynamite had sales anywhere near Valiant's than they wouldn't have to worry about canceling titles whatsoever, but they refuse to advertise past a books launch and leave it up to the readers to buy them based on what, a few nice looking covers? Please, this is 2013, not 1997. Don't get me wrong because I love DE, but they're treatment of certain properties leaves a lot to be desired and there is nothing you can say that can remedy that.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Right, gotta wade in here. Valiant are publishing some great books - Archer & Armstrong in particular - but their top selling title on the CBR Dec 2012 sales estimates chart is only on a par with Dynamite's top selling title, and in general their books aren't exactly flying off the shelves in comparison to Dynamite's. There was a lot of curiosity value in Valiant's relaunch thanks to readers with fond memories of the original books, but as time's passing those sales numbers are falling back down to a level more realistic for that of a publisher outside the top two. Of course, the sales charts are only estimates and don't cover UK/digital sales, but they're a good indicator of general performance.

                      I don't really see that sustained advertising would have any significant impact either - the guys at Dynamite know what works and what doesn't, and if sustained advertising was the missing link then you can be sure that they'd be doing that, but it's just not the case. Flash Gordon launched with a $1 full length 22-page issue and it still didn't find enough of an audience, and that's a book with first class writing and top drawer artwork. If launching a book for $1 doesn't bring in the numbers, no amount of advertising is going to change that. Even the likes of Marvel have published books which were critically acclaimed yet still didn't generate sufficient sales to survive. And where would you target this sustained advertising? Previews? Who still buys that? Online? Well, outside of Newsarama and CBR (where Dynamite already advertise), where? Every week we release 5-7 page previews of our latest releases, lettered and coloured, online via CBR. It's an excellent "try before you buy" way of promoting the books. If people have better suggestions then I'm sure Nick would be all ears, but targeting other forms of media on a long term basis just wouldn't be cost effective for a niche product such as comic books.

                      I personally thought the Peter Cannon book was a fantastic series and I'm surprised that it's struggled, but believe me - if there was a way of keeping it going, Dynamite would have taken that option instead of bringing the series to a close. But there's nothing to say that the book won't be retooled and tweaked, and then relaunched at a later date. Sometimes that's what it takes in order for a book to find an audience, and again - even Marvel have to do that at times and I'm pretty sure that, down the line, Valiant will be forced to do exactly the same.

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Thanks Simon, for bringing a voice of sanity to what amounts to a bunch of crybaby whining. Nobody likes it, people, but for god's sake, let's act like grown-up adults.
                        DE pull list: Will Eisner's The Spirit: The Corpse Makers, ERB's The Greatest Adventure, Green Hornet '66 Meets The Spirit, PSP: Herokillers, KISS/Vampirella, Mighty Mouse

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Okay....

                          I can see the light from both sides and both sides have made valid points. But one thing I will not tolerate is name calling and members taking jabs at each other, if this continues than infractions will be handed out. Who's the biggest "cry baby"? The baby that cries, or the baby who cries back?

                          Be civil.

                          As for my take on this situation: Dynamite publishes great books, and even I think they need to get bigger names on titles to sell more issues, but when cash is limited you canonly do what you can do. As for the Valiant discussion, they're 5 titles equal a total of over 60k in sales over the last few months, that's actually quite impressive and they're putting out fantastic books as well as Dynamite.
                          Last edited by comixfan1980; 01-26-2013, 08:01 AM.
                          Dynamite Entertainment
                          Forum Administrator


                          Check out Dynamite on Twitter here!

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Bah! I've had it to my eyes with dynamite canceling comics on me and I have decided to buy valiant comics and and go back to DC comics instead. The superpowers fall off and the Kirby fall off really hurt my faith in dynamite and the pulps brought it back but now. They cancellled flash and now cannon and I just can't take it anymore its demoralizing. I'm afraid ive going to have to say so long to dynamite and hope that they don't screw the pulp readers over with cancellation notices or abandon them for 3 years like they did with superpowers. I don't mean to be mean but I'm just being honest. Excuses excuses is all I hear and its just getting blah.

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              I feel like I just wasted twenty minutes of my time and I won't make that mistake again...

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