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Issue #6 ***spoilers***

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  • Issue #6 ***spoilers***

    Joe wasn't kidding when he said #6 was awesome. This issue rocks! It's a real coming of age for the man who wears the mask. The story takes some unusual twists and blazes a new trail in Lone Ranger lore. I like that Dan's widow could tell who he is through the mask. I liked hearing Black Bart's story and seeing his empathy for the Ranger. My heart skipped a beat at the rearing of Silver and the cry "Hi-Yo Silver!" It was interesting to see the Lone Ranger "rescue" Tonto.
    There are some minor problems with the issue, but over all a great pleasure to read and a good way to wrap the story arc. There are still some unresolved issues that will probably come clear as the tale continues. I sure am looking forward to more great adventures ahead.

  • #2
    “This mask is my face.” What a Great moment!

    I have a couple of questions though. Actually more a yearning to see anyone discuss it. It’s really one question, just kinda drawn out. I’d love to see anyone’s take on it

    What is Tonto’s motivation in all this?
    Why did he help to begin with?
    Why did he hide the fact the Ranger’s families were being slaughtered from John?
    He says, “You would have arrived only to find their bodies” Ok, how is that any different from doing nothing and knowing he did nothing to save their bodies? He still has to contend with the fact that he failed to save them, only this way he didn’t even try.
    I guess Tonto kept John from getting himself killed (or killing) , ok that’s good “he wasn’t ready”.
    Ready for what? What is John. “learning” in the interim? What is Tonto waiting for that he thinks John needs to learn or will learn?
    They spend a day being good guys saving a “lady”, stopping a bank robbery, and breaking up a poker mach and announcing to the world they have “arrived!” so what?
    Finally we see John stop Tonto from killing. Is that the defining moment Tonto was waiting for? When he knew John was ready?
    OK, but he still tells him he sees “nothing” after that.
    And John seems to agree with him.
    In the mean time Tonto has taken a huge risk allowing Bart to reach Dan’s wife before John.
    Another stalling tactic again for what? And how did he know Bart wouldn’t just go ahead and kill her and her son anyway.
    Tonto's telegram is meant to avert Bart back to Bryant’s Gap? Where Tonto will be waiting to play possum in place of John.
    Again Tonto is stalling for what?
    At this point, why couldn’t he have let John face Bart before Bart even got to Dan’s wife’s house? He knew that’s exactlly where Bart was heading next.
    What did John learn? Did stalling him make him "not a killer"? (Especially not to kill out of revenge). Is that what Tonto wanted him to learn? Again what was Tonto’s motivation in that?
    Does Tonto hate that about himself, and want John to rise above it somehow, for some reason? Why would he?
    That seems to be what is missing from this introduction.

    All I could think of is Tonto wanted John to realize he was not alone, and that he did not have to be alone. But towards the end Tonto specifically tells him “You must do this alone, One way or the other. Do it and you will know what you are”
    Which is what John would have had to do from the get-go anyway.
    So what is Tonto’s motivation in all this, I don’t see it, do you?

    And why dye the shirt blue? Was that supposed to mean something?
    Last edited by Guicho; 06-07-2007, 04:32 PM.

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    • #3
      some of this new origin just doesn't make much sense at all. I still can't figure out why the writer honestly doesn't believe that a texas ranger would've been friends with an indian. I'm sorry but it wasn't pure segregationalism during the big push west like people believe.

      But that's alright I guess.
      Last edited by Kevin; 06-07-2007, 01:18 PM.

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      • #4
        Where did the writer say he doesn't believe that a Texas Ranger would've been friends with an Indian?
        Haven’t read any of the interviews with Matthews, can you direct me towards any?
        Last edited by Guicho; 06-07-2007, 02:37 PM.

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        • #5
          Originally posted by Guicho
          Where did the writer say he doesn't believe that a Texas Ranger would've been friends with an Indian?
          Haven’t read any of the interviews with Matthews, can you direct me towards any?
          I can't remember the exact quote, but it's in one of those pod casts anyway he says something to the effect about how it was a too corny that they were friends and had met before as children and he wanted to change that to update it because it wasn't realistic or something to that effect.

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          • #6
            Friends

            [blank look]
            what on *earth* are you all talking about?? the ONLY person in the entire story who didn't believe the ranger and indian could be friends was Black Bart, and that was just before he admitted his whole perceptions of life was based on skin color.

            the only actual mistake was the translation of 'kemo sabay.' the originator of the phrase was quite adamant that it NEVER meant 'faithful friend,' but ONLY 'trusty scout.'
            cindy
            Last edited by CindyR; 06-07-2007, 09:43 PM.

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            • #7
              Originally posted by Kevin
              I can't remember the exact quote, but it's in one of those pod casts anyway he says something to the effect about how it was a too corny that they were friends and had met before as children and he wanted to change that to update it because it wasn't realistic or something to that effect.
              I believe he was only stating that it was too coincidental that they would have met as children, and then Tonto would find Reid after the ambush. That's why they eliminated the 'boyhood friends' part of the original tale.
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              • #8
                tonto's motivation

                sorry, Guicho, man, but the only part of the questions i saw really discussion useful was about tonto's motivation. and that's a good one--one i've speculated about since i saw my first ep as a kid.
                the rest of the answers are pretty self-evident by re-reading the comic, esp. if you can read it from issues 1-6.

                Is tonto crafting a partner or a weapon? he's obviously letting the boy test himself to learn once and for all what he's made of, what kind of man he is or will be under fire. the battle with Bart ALONE was the ultimate test of what John Reid would be and tonto seemed pleased that the boy remained pure-hearted. so did tonto face bad in the past and wanted to fight it but could not do it himself? or is he loading a gun and getting ready to point it?

                i think tonto learned he didn't HAVE to be a killer--he's seeing that pure heart as kind of a beacon for his own. and john learned what he was at the core...maybe until he finds butch.

                as an aside...the Ranger let Bart go. Did...um, anyone happen to remember that Bart had killed at least a couple of women and children and intended on another before he was diverted? and many more deaths besides? soooo...wouldn't a lawman, like *arrest* him???-cindy

                Quote:
                What did John learn? Did stalling him make him "not a killer"? (Especially not to kill out of revenge). Is that what Tonto wanted him to learn? Again what was Tonto’s motivation in that?
                Does Tonto hate that about himself, and want John to rise above it somehow, for some reason? (I think this has something to do with it, don't you?-cindy)

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                • #9
                  Originally posted by MadMikeyD
                  I believe he was only stating that it was too coincidental that they would have met as children, and then Tonto would find Reid after the ambush. That's why they eliminated the 'boyhood friends' part of the original tale.
                  In the same breath he also said he had to update the whole origin a little because it wouldn't be believable to today's readers -- something about like that. I think he was talking about the whole kit and kaboodle.

                  Either case, eliminating this coincidence I believe has somewhat hurt the relationship. I don't think it's anything major, I just think the retelling of their relationship seems a little "odd". Odd as in a "Yeah ummm I don't get why they're even speaking with each other" type of way.

                  It's just a minor complaint guys I'm not saying I'm dropping this book or anything like that.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    coincidences

                    i understand your pov. i kind'a disagree tho, just because i've *always* agreed the coincidence of their meeting as children was too extreme to be believable. i personally was trying to overlook that coincidence in earlier versions!

                    as to why they're even speaking to each other...?
                    that's the most intriguing question of all. i can understand the boy's view--guy saves his life, helps him capture bad guy, etc., and at a time when he *needs*a friend more than anything.
                    i think tonto is starting to honestly like the boy now. but why stick around in the first place?
                    i think matthews is planning something. {wink}

                    Originally posted by Kevin
                    Either case, eliminating this coincidence I believe has somewhat hurt the relationship. I don't think it's anything major, I just think the retelling of their relationship seems a little "odd". Odd as in a "Yeah ummm I don't get why they're even speaking with each other" type of way.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      I just picked up my copy last night. NEAR PERFECTION!!! That's what a Lone Ranger comic should be! I did like the new twist that Linda Reid is still alive, and Dan Jr. already got to meet his uncle. The dialogue between Bart and the Ranger was terriffic. I got chills at 'The mask is my face.' Did Bart make it out of the wreckage to send Cavendish that last telegram? Or did someone else send it? Bart was in pretty bad shape. Maybe he had an idea he'd end up in a bad way and sent it in advance, 'just in case.' Now I have to go re-read the story as a whole. Bring on #7!
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                      • #12
                        Beautiful....(or all this and no 4 letter words)

                        ....Is the only way to describe this issue. I finally broke down and actually read it. I haven't even read the Creed story yet, just skimmed the panels. I did the same here but couldn't hold out any longer. Page six was the greatest "shout out"/Valentine to both fans old and new I have ever seen. Come on secretly you know Dan's expression/reaction is how every LR fan feels or has felt about the character whether having discovered him in childhood or not. If that wasn't intentional then Mr. Matthews needs to rethink his position on coincidence. I wonder about Bart though, why would John leave him there? I'm sure this isn't his version of "justice". I think he's trailing him back to Butch if he read him right he knows that Butch wold have to send somebody to take care of Bart which could lead John back to Butch. If not then maybe this is the controversial scene that "might upset some die hard fans" that was mentioned in the podcast. If it is I don't mind much, the creed was pretty much upheld, but if this is Matthews' version of the Batman Begins' "I won't kill you but I won't save you either" schtick then I'd prefer that it doesn't come up much in the series. But I have no fear it will. I'd also like to say that this issue alone has helped me make the decision to share this with kids its not so bad especially in a time when Robin is using the "B"word in a code approved comic. This is good responsible comics writing its all about story and character not exploring cartoon sexuality, political allegory or any other nonsense. Even if it doesn't win an Eisner I think its a book Eisner and them would have read which says so much more than any award can. Too bad LRFan and the others who dropped the title aren't around they missed a great ride.

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                        • #13
                          It's better than 99% of the DC and Marvel books on the market

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                          • #14
                            Originally posted by Kevin
                            It's better than 99% of the DC and Marvel books on the market
                            Only 99%?
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                            • #15
                              Originally posted by MadMikeyD
                              Only 99%?
                              Hey, I love Alex Ross and Deadpool/Cable is fun What can I say ;D

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